18:I[66739,["/_next/static/chunks/0u0nyy7wb9me2.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/05hx6kuf6-oy4.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/12hmyxte1w1dw.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/166.u_60qj09..js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/0g9_wl34k-6l4.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/06dn~uer6.43l.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i"],"default"] 1a:I[38632,["/_next/static/chunks/0qqtp3r0h7kah.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i","/_next/static/chunks/0iukvycbd42rl.js?dpl=dpl_EVxQmm5ee6SfSwpTLEi7dkcqj48i"],"IconMark"] 19:T455,

When you hear or read about the American-led rules-based liberal international order do you think: “Yes! That’s important to me and my grandchildren and it needs to be sustained at all costs!”

Or do you agree with a recent front-page article in the Wall Street Journal that reported, with no hint of disapproval, that “China and its allies are no longer obliged to conform to a U.S.-led global order”?

Or do you think: "What global order? I don’t see any global order!"

These are just a few of the questions that host Cliff May asks our guest for this episode, Ambassador Kurt Volker. He served as the U.S. ambassador to NATO and is a leading expert in foreign and national security policy with over 35 years of experience in a variety of government, academic, and private sector capacities.

Also joining the conversation is Reuel Marc Gerecht, resident scholar at FDD, whose previous career was in the CIA’s Directorate of Operations.

The U.S.-led Global Order and Its Discontents

FDD's Foreign Podicy

The U.S.-led Global Order and Its Discontents