It might sound counterintuitive, but when it comes to the art of persuasion, using a logic-first approach is the last thing you want to do. This is because, in reality, every human being is wired to feel first, and reason later.

Josh Bandoch is Senior Vice President for Policy Research at the Foundation for Research Into Equal Opportunity and has spent years becoming a master of persuasion. His latest book, How to Get What You Want: Mastering the Art and Science of Persuasion, is the ultimate guide to understanding the techniques that will actually move people, and the science behind why.

In this episode, Greg and Josh discuss the critical role of emotional intelligence in effective persuasion, how to listen and engage with your audience, “the granny test,” and how Montesquieu’s teachings on particularism can apply to persuasion.

*unSILOed Podcast is produced by University FM.*

Episode Quotes:

Research rigor isn't enough on its own

[05:44] We want to marry the IQ that the research rigor, the intellectualism gives us, you have to marry that with emotional intelligence. Because you could have the most rigorously researched paper in the history of mankind and if you deliver that in a way that is not emotionally intelligent, might or might be emotionally unintelligent, then it’s going to be counterproductive. So, you need to marry those two together and think about how you deliver this information in a way that your audience receives it warmly and they’re willing to actually do something that you want them to do with it. That’s where the sweet spot is.

Every human being is wired to feel first, and reason later.

[05:12] All a billion of us are wired to feel first then reason. Sometimes it’s feel then reason. Sometimes it’s a feeling we never get to reasoning. And moreover, people who tragically suffer brain damage and lose the ability to emote, they actually see their reasoning impaired, which means that the logic-first approach to persuasion is actually illogical.

Why we can't stop talking about ourselves

[12:02] There are five aspects of our cognitive wiring that are foundational to persuasion that are central to the book. One is that it’s about them, not you, but we’re wired to think and talk all about ourselves, which isn’t persuasive. So, we’re wired to think and talk about ourselves. Talking about ourselves generates the same sensations in our brain as sex and money. It feels really good. And it’s just, it’s a survival mechanism. So, like if we don’t think a talk about ourselves, who’s going to? Quite possibly nobody.

On what he thinks about AI being more persuasive than humans.

[51:52] I’m open to the prospect that the average AI can be more persuasive than the average human because maybe the average human doesn’t bring the calm, or maybe there are some basic, sort of, persuasion tools that AI can use. I still don’t think, and I don’t think we’ll ever be at the point where the most persuasive AI is going to be as good as the most persuasive humans. And even if we are, it’s still the humans who are making the decisions.

Show Links:

Recommended Resources:

Guest Profile:

Vice President Profile at The Foundation for Research on Equal Opportunity
Professional Website
Professional Profile on LinkedIn

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674. What Most People Misunderstand About Persuasion & How to Get It Right with Josh Bandoch

unSILOed with Greg LaBlanc

674. What Most People Misunderstand About Persuasion & How to Get It Right with Josh Bandoch