Michael Crow is the president of Arizona State University, which U.S. News & World Report has called the most innovative school in the country for 11 years running. He tells Steve about why higher education needs to change, and how A.S.U. is leading the way. Plus: Steve has an announcement about the podcast.

SOURCES:
- Michael Crow, president of Arizona State University.

RESOURCES:
- The Fifth Wave: The Evolution of American Higher Education, by Michael Crow (2020).
- "College Admissions Shocker!," by Frank Bruni (New York Times, 2016).
- New American University.
- Dreamscape Learn.
- University Innovation Alliance.
- FYI.AI.

EXTRAS:
- "Chemistry, Evolved," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2025).
- "America’s Math Curriculum Doesn’t Add Up," by People I (Mostly) Admire (2021).
- Data Science 4 Everyone.

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172. A New Kind of University

People I (Mostly) Admire

172. A New Kind of University