Ezra Klein argues that the left desperately needs a unifying project — for its own survival and for the sake of the country. In this episode of Ross Douthat’s “Interesting Times,” Ross and Ezra assess the aftermath of Charlie Kirk’s assassination and debate whether the left has taken a dark turn.

00:25 How liberalism became “uncertain and exhausted”
08:37 The void in the Democratic Party
12:21 Does progressive despair lead to radicalism?
15:04 “Violence is contagious"
19:24 Can the left be more malleable?
28:20 The hippies, Peter Thiel and technology
32:11 Does the American left need cosmic hope?
41:59 A vision of the “good life”

Thoughts? Email us at interestingtimes@nytimes.com. Please subscribe to our YouTube Channel, Interesting Times with Ross Douthat.

A full transcript of this episode is also available on the Times website.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Ezra Klein Is Worried — but Not About a Radicalized Left

Interesting Times with Ross Douthat

Ezra Klein Is Worried — but Not About a Radicalized Left