The tit-for-tat tariff escalations between the US and China are on pause, at least temporarily. But if the world’s two biggest economies don’t make progress by July, they could return with a vengeance. How can the two parties make progress? And what does China actually want from the US? Soumaya Keynes speaks to Jay Shambaugh to find out. Shambaugh was the US Treasury’s undersecretary for international affairs under Joe Biden. In other words, he was in charge of the US’s economic relationship with China. He and Soumaya discuss how the Trump administration could negotiate with China, and how interwoven trade policy and national security have become.

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Presented by Soumaya Keynes. Produced by Mischa Frankl-Duval. Flo Phillips is the executive producer. Original music and sound design by Breen Turner. The FT’s acting co-head of audio is Manuela Saragosa.

Read a transcript of this episode on FT.com

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What does China want from the US? With Jay Shambaugh

The Economics Show

What does China want from the US? With Jay Shambaugh