Yi-Ling Liu on The Wall Dancers: China's Internet, Its Creative Spirits, and the Art of the Possible

The podcast explores the evolution of the Chinese internet through the lens of "wall dancers"—individuals who navigate state constraints with creativity and pragmatism. Yi-Ling Liu, author of "The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet," discusses how these figures, from a closeted cop turned gay dating app CEO to feminist activists and science fiction writers, embody a dynamic relationship between state and society. The conversation examines the rise and fall of techno-utopianism, the convergence of censorship tactics between the U.S. and China, and the co-option of cultural movements like hip hop and science fiction for national projects. Liu emphasizes that while technology isn't inherently liberating, the Chinese experience highlights the importance of defining and protecting diverse forms of freedom in the digital age.