In this episode of Excess Returns, we sit down with Neil Howe, author of The Fourth Turning Is Here and co-creator of the Fourth Turning generational framework, along with Ben Hunt of Epsilon Theory, to discuss where we are in the current cycle and what it means for markets, inflation, AI, capital flows, and America’s long-term economic outlook. From the debasement trade and rising gold prices to global capital crowding out and the structural forces shaping productivity and growth, this conversation connects generational theory with real-world investing decisions. If you’re thinking about inflation, deficits, AI capital spending, global diversification, or how to position defensively and offensively in a shifting macro regime, this discussion provides a powerful framework for navigating what may be a historic transition period.

Topics Covered

The Fourth Turning framework and where we are in the current crisis cycle
Why inflation is not a problem but a policy solution in major crises
The collapse in US national savings and long-term deficit risks
Capital flows, the debasement trade, and the future of the US dollar
Gold, commodities, and real assets in a regime shift
Global diversification and opportunities outside the United States
AI capital spending, productivity gains, and the risk of overinvestment
Crowding out effects from government deficits and AI hyper scaling
Trust, geopolitics, and the long-term implications for global markets
Healthcare, demographics, and structural investment themes
Defensive and offensive positioning in a Fourth Turning environment

Timestamps

00:00 Inflation as a solution and the generational crisis framework
04:00 Explaining the Fourth Turning and historical crisis cycles
12:55 Narratives, generational archetypes, and market behavior
22:24 Is the Fourth Turning pessimistic or optimistic
34:00 Inflation, gold, and the debasement trade
40:00 Global capital flows and the reversal of US inflows
50:00 AI capital spending and the K shaped capital markets
55:09 Crowding out, deficits, and slow growth risks
01:02:23 Defensive and offensive investment positioning
01:09:31 Final thoughts on diversification, gold, and financials

The Fourth Turning is Here | Neil Howe and Ben Hunt on Inflation, Trust and What Comes Next

Excess Returns