In this conversation, we explore AI bias, transformative justice, and the future of technology with Dr. Avriel Epps, computational social scientist, Civic Science Postdoctoral Fellow at Cornell University's CATLab, and co-founder of AI for Abolition.

What makes this conversation unique is how it begins with Avriel's recently published children's book, A Kids Book About AI Bias (Penguin Random House), designed for ages 5-9. As an accomplished researcher with a PhD from Harvard and expertise in how algorithmic systems impact identity development, Avriel has taken on the remarkable challenge of translating complex technical concepts about AI bias into accessible language for the youngest learners.

Key themes we explore:

- The Translation Challenge: How to distill graduate-level research on algorithmic bias into concepts a six-year-old can understand—and why kids' unfiltered responses to AI bias reveal truths adults often struggle to articulate

- Critical Digital Literacy: Why building awareness of AI bias early can serve as a protective mechanism for young people who will be most vulnerable to these systems

- AI for Abolition: Avriel's nonprofit work building community power around AI, including developing open-source tools like "Repair" for transformative and restorative justice practitioners

- The Incentive Problem: Why the fundamental issue isn't the technology itself, but the economic structures driving AI development—and how communities might reclaim agency over systems built from their own data

- Generational Perspectives: How different generations approach digital activism, from Gen Z's innovative but potentially ephemeral protest methods to what Gen Alpha might bring to technological resistance

Throughout our conversation, Avriel demonstrates how critical analysis of technology can coexist with practical hope. Her work embodies the belief that while AI currently reinforces existing inequalities, it doesn't have to—if we can change who controls its development and deployment.

The conversation concludes with Avriel's ongoing research into how algorithmic systems shaped public discourse around major social and political events, and their vision for "small tech" solutions that serve communities rather than extracting from them.

For anyone interested in AI ethics, youth development, or the intersection of technology and social justice, this conversation offers both rigorous analysis and genuine optimism about what's possible when we center equity in technological development.

About Dr. Avriel Epps:

Dr. Avriel Epps (she/they) is a computational social scientist and a Civic Science Postdoctoral Fellow at the Cornell University CATLab. She completed her Ph.D. at Harvard University in Education with a concentration in Human Development. She also holds an S.M. in Data Science from Harvard’s School of Engineering and Applied Sciences and a B.A. in Communication Studies from UCLA.

Previously a Ford Foundation predoctoral fellow, Avriel is currently a Fellow at The National Center on Race and Digital Justice, a Roddenberry Fellow, and a Public Voices Fellow on Technology in the Public Interest with the Op-Ed Project in partnership with the MacArthur Foundation.

Avriel is also the co-founder of AI4Abolition, a community organization dedicated to increasing AI literacy in marginalized communities and building community power with and around data-driven technologies. Avriel has been invited to speak at various venues including tech giants like Google and TikTok, and for The U.S. Courts, focusing on algorithmic bias and fairness.

In the Fall of 2025, she will begin her tenure as Assistant Professor of Fair and Responsible Data Science at Rutgers University.

Links:- Dr. Epps' official website: https://www.avrielepps.com

- AI for Abolition: https://www.ai4.org

- A Kids Book About AI Bias details: https://www.avrielepps.com/book

Avriel Epps: Teaching Kids About AI Bias

Stay Human, from the Artificiality Institute