In this episode of HR Heretics, Nolan and Kelli are joined by Joelle Emerson, CEO of Paradigm, to discuss why diversity numbers aren't improving quickly in companies and the challenges in measuring DEI progress.

This episode explores the complexities of measuring impact, discusses the trade-offs of long-term strategies, and offers insights for navigating the current backlash.

*Email us your questions or topics for Kelli & Nolan: hrheretics@turpentine.co

HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.

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KEEP UP WITH JOELLE, NOLAN, + KELLI ON LINKEDIN

Joelle: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joelle-emerson-4a24225

Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/

Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich/

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LINKS:

Paradigm:

https://www.paradigmiq.com/

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TIMESTAMPS:

(00:00) Intro

(00:58) Paradigm's mission and work in diversity and inclusion

(01:55) Discussion on slow progress in diversity representation

(03:48) Long-term investments in diversity initiatives

(06:52) Measuring progress and acknowledging small wins in DEI

(10:47) Adapting DEI work in response to backlash

(14:37) Importance of effective messaging in DEI efforts

(14:48) Sponsors: Planful | Workvivo

(17:26) Distraction from the Backlash

(27:28) Sponsors: Metaview | Warp

(27:55) Legal considerations and challenges in DEI work

(30:51) Discussion on problematic hiring practices in DEI

(34:43) Turning down clients who don't align with DEI values

(36:37) The role of dedicated DEI teams in organizations

(39:29) Echo chambers and polarization in DEI discussions

(44:38) Trade-offs in DEI investments and hiring processes

(47:38) Debate on blind auditions and diversity in hiring

(49:45) Wrap

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The Long Game of DEI: A Conversation with Joelle Emerson

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